[Tradjazz] The Dixieland Band

[Bruce McNichols]

I see that Steve Barbone and I are pretty much on the same page.  

One point:  The way I read George Hunt's message was that he was saying that the instrumentation in the band he was in (in his youth) just happened to have those five instrument, rather than they were copying the ODJB.  I think that that's what he meant when he said that the ODJB had nothing to do with it.  As Steve says, they had everything to do with it, mainly because they were they proto-typical Dixieland band.

McN


      To: <tradjazz at list.okom.com>  
      Subject: [Tradjazz] The Dixieland Band  
      Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2006 13:16:53 -0400  
      From: Steve Barbone <barbonestreet at earthlink.net>   

Interesting view.

ODJB, IMO, had everything to do with the 5 piece "Dixieland" Band. Consider
that pre ODJB, New Orleans Jazz Bands (where it all began) has various
instrumentation. Buddy Bolden circa 1905 used Guitar & String Bass so some
poor kids must have had them. Likewise Kid Ory when in The Woodland Band,
circa 1905 was joined by Guitar and String Bass, Trumpet, Violin & Drums.
The Original Creole Orchestra with Freddie Keppard on trumpet, circa 1914
used guitar and string Bass in addition to trombone, clarinet and drums.

Tom Brown's band from Dixieland then went to the quintet format that George
likes. They were followed by Johnny Stein's Band from "Dixieland" who used
the same format. (with Nick LaRocca on cornet). Then ODJB was formed by
LaRocca using the "white" quintet format. Cornet, Trombone, Clarinet, Piano,
Drums. After they made their recordings, jazz took off. And countless bands,
checking out ODJB's success, COPIED their instrumentation.

E.G. Violinists all over New Orleans lost their jobs because ODJB did not
have one. Kid Ory, in whose band Joe Oliver was playing, fired his guitarist
because ODJB did not have one. And bands all over New Orleans migrated to
Chicago because that's where the money was for "Dixieland".

Still, some bands continued in 6 or 7 piece format. The New Orleans Rhythm
kings used a string bass in theirs, circa 1922 at the Friar's Inn, adding a
second reed (saxophone) to Leon Roppolo's clarinet. Perhaps they used the
bass because they were unabashedly copying the black, blues based sound in
jazz and not ODJB. And Joe Oliver, in 1923 used a string bass (Bill Johnson)
in 1923 with his 7 piece Creole Jazz Band when Louis played 2nd cornet.

Bix? He paid homage to ODJB also with his first recordings under his own
name on OKEH with Royal Garden Blues, Jazz Me Blues and At The Jazz Band
Ball, all from their repertoire. Suffice it to say Bix was heavily
influenced by ODJB.

While it may not have nee apparent to the high school kids of the 1930's the
ODJB influence on others, including Louis, was well established

Here is a quote from Richard Sudhalter's "Lost Chords."

"The influence of the ODJB on  New Orleans musicians of both races has been
extensively documented. . . Joe Oliver and Kid Ory, still at home (new
Orleans) fired the respected multi-instrumentalist and teacher Manuel 'Fess'
Manetta because said Manetta; 'they wanted to follow the format of the
Original Dixieland Jazz Band and use only 5 pieces.'"

ODJB had everything to do with both the 5 piece format as well as the word
"Dixieland" as a musical description rather than a place description. Not
because they were the first band to use it and not because they were the
greatest band ever. But because they POPULARIZED Dixieland Jazz with the
mass audience all over the world. And all those other five piece bands
copied their format because of their popularity and because popularity is
what makes money for the musicians, in the 1920s as well as today. And what
ever influenced the high school kids of the 1930s, flowed from ODJB, Bix and
Louis either directly or indirectly.

But, no Guitar, no String Bass? Lordy, don't tell Eddie Condon that. He
produced an enormous swinging musical legacy using those very instruments
and kept the music alive with them. And don't tell Arvell Shaw that. He
played sting bass with Louis Armstrong's All Stars and kept that music
swinging and alive.

Why don't most Dixieland bands follow that ODJB inspired 5 piece format
today? Simply because it is incomplete in today's version of the music. If
you want a band to really swing, IMO, you need a string bass and/or an
accomplished tubist who can lay down the bottom line like a string bass. And
a competent guitar simply adds to the swing. No doubt why Davern and/or
Reinhart and countless others use both whenever they can.

And BTW, Drums being essential? Not according to Louis Armstrong's Hot Five.
Lordy, he even used a Banjo (Johnny St Cyr) along with Kid Ory, Johnny
Dodds, and Lil. One of THE SEMINAL RECORDING UNITS in jazz. "No Camp Town
Races" there in that group.

Yeah, I know, drums didn't record well, but then neither did String Bass and
Guitar until electric recording became the norm.

My opinion is that all sorts of instrumentation can be well used in
Dixieland, and/or jazz. Depends upon what the band and leader wish to do.
They all work and like my pal Thelonious Monk said one day. "Never say
something can't be done in music. Because the moment you do, somebody will
come along and do it." Solid advice to me when I was a young wannabe.

Cheers,
Steve Barbone 




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